Off Topic > General Furry Talk
A well defined fursona
Fineas:
In one of my reactions on the introduction section of the forums, I specifically reacted on what a fursona is and what in my opinion a well defined fursona is.
The quote:
--- Quote from: Fineas on 14.10.2014, 11:40:31 ---About terminology have a brief look at this:
http://en.wikifur.com/wiki/Fursona
In short if you talk about fursona we talk about an 'avatar' that is your (animal) character.
This character can have a drawing or multiple drawings and when you use it on the boards we call it a profile picture.
Having a fursona is not a must (in my opinion) persee.
More importantly, is when you have one is that you identify yourself with. Don't just pick one because it's cool; explorer and see what sticks with you.
If you feel 'this cat character' you have been drawing, writing about or have build up from all kinds of sources is someone you feel closely related by.
Then in my book you have a well defined fursona and furries will like to talk to you about them just because they see things that spark their interest.
--- End quote ---
Here bellow I'm going to elaborate on this further in depth.
If you see something you so much disagree with you skip to the bottom to comment, then please at least have the courtesy to stay polite and let me know you stumbled over it and didn't want to read further.
What makes a well defined fursona
A personal connection
And NOT just a it is a cool/popular thing at the moment. It should represent you and/or represent where you stand for. If you are a rough party guy/girl maybe you are a wolf or a hyena. If you are a caring shy person that like sweet things you could consider a mouse, red panda or honey badger. These are generalizations and not nearly puts the point I'm trying to make in perspective. But bottom line is, your choice should make sense for what you want to be.
Then it's easy to sway the other way from here and say: "let me choose the least popular race". This however isn't the right way to go either. Because it could alienate you (a bit) as no one else can (immediately) identify with you until they have heard your story. It could make for an interesting mysterious character however, which is perfectly fine if that is what you are going for.
Depth
They should be more then a face/mask. Have some background, stories, definition to it. Make that character live. Where did they come from? What friends did they have? Why do they do what they do? What are their goals? Why does this character represent you so well?
The other option is to just explain why you feel you are this species and this fursona. Like I explained in the personal connection part. It's perfectly fine if you say "this character IS me" they do not have any background story of their own, because they ARE me. But then try to convey (if you want people to understand why you choose them) feel and understand why it does fit. Which is not a requirement, but a recommendation from me for if you feel uncertain people are accepting you and your fursona.
They should (more or less) apply to you / be a reflection of your soul.
It's fine to play a character and portrait them and even call those a fursonas, but personally I feel YOUR fursona should reflect what it defines what/who YOU are and what you stand for or really aspire to be. This goes further then simply the race or the looks. The character self should act the way you want it to be and do not let yourself be swayed by personal opinion or just let the choice be determined with what you think should make it a likable character. In my opinion you should even aspire to do just the opposite. O... this is a trait I do not like about myself, but I feel that is what really defines me. Then I repeat what Tyrion Lannister (GOT) said: "Never forget what you are. The rest of the world will not. Wear it like armor, and it can never be used to hurt you."
If you want to forget them and rather not be associated with them, that is fine leave them out. However, if you really feel, deep inside that this trait makes you who YOU are, then leave it in and heed that advice. That makes for a unique, interesting and likable character.
Unique
With a quickly growing community in it's easy to pick a popular species or look, but in my opinion a fursona should be you, you are an unique invidiual. Not a 1000 words or a full A4 page of text could define a single person. Not any of us is that bland. So a fursona should not be just another face in the crowd. He, she or it (or other variation) should have some outstanding features that make hem identifiable.
What I dislike in (some) fursonas
This is an opinion piece and does not throw up a barrier. Everyone is free to find about it what they want and (keep) do(ing) it themselves if they recognized it. I'm just putting it out their to have some ground on this discussion.
The I picked that character only because it looked cool.
I dislike it even more if the character is from an existing story/universe/series. YES, you can play it that's fine, but it in 99% of the cases says nearly nothing about you and doesn't make me identify you with the character. And makes for a bad fursona.
What we see is that character and identify with that. But then we get unsure, because... are you going to roleplay everything we know about that character? Even if we do... where does the character start and you begin?
When you do it like that it's almost as if you are talking to a friend you have known for a while, but someone just like him suddenly shows up, acts like him, but is clearly not the same person. It makes for awkward conversation as the in-character roleplay will break down very quickly in real life conversation.
Nonsensical or over complicated hybrids.
This is a large gray area so bare with me here. With non nonsensical I mean that just combining two races does not necessarily make for an interesting character, especially when the mechanics or anatomy of one race does not at all add up.
A good example is the thing going on with Pokemon hybrids (give this a look: http://www.buzzfeed.com/awesomer/incredible-pokemon-mash-ups#.jmdDQvZAy). To be fair, they do not all look that bad, but a lot of them just are... non aesthetically presentable or for lack of better wording look really ugly.
In my opinion: (almost) all (real world) animals are beautiful because they have evolved to be best at a specific function and be a better fit for their environment. Everything within their being makes senses, breaths purpose and just belongs.
The easiest but still non-trivial way to figure out if a character belongs to this category is ask the questions which you would normally ask about an animal or pet. What does it eat? How does it's life cycle work (from child to adulthood)? How does it's life start (life birth or from an egg)? How do they reproduce?
If you can give easy or at least, give some explanation about them, that makes them more 'real' and it is easier to say, yes that's a cool character.
If you can not, at every single question, in my opinion you created a character with the depth of a banana with googly eyes. http://media.boingboing.net/wp-content/uploads/2013/03/8511807319_6eb5b3b737_b.jpg
Near this category are hybrids that are unnecessarily long and complicated. The purpose of a hybrid is to make for an interesting character and combine different traits. That the character IS a hybrid doesn't necessarily make it interesting. Especially when you brake the above 'rule of thumb' or choose to combine things that are to close together.
See this video for example:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mZsB7LxgCek
I personally think it is funny and touches on a some of the clichés and misconceptions of the furry fandom (even if you disagree, again it's an opinion thing).
The goomba says he is an: "Arctic-Fox-Wolf"
Which is thus a combination of a fox and a wolf. Where the race is of a cold climate variety. Sounds sensible enough, however: foxes and wolfs are both of the K9 or canine family. It doesn't make a lot of sense to combine them, unless you actually use specific traits of both races. Foxes are loners that hunt for easy meals, wolfs pack up and work together to secure a full and tasty meal for a longer period and their whole pack. And lots of other unique traits.
If you do not figure out a way for that to work within this specific hybrid, it really just sounds to me that the combination only exists to sound cool and interesting. But is nothing more then that.
In this specific video he even says "Goomba? That name has no meaning to me. I am..." which makes him specifically deny his real person (he is never out of character). Sounds like a person in 'denial'. JUST having a fursona doesn't make you a whole person, which is an indication on why this is not a well thought out character, but just a place holder to represent that which one is missing in life. Not always, but it happens.
Back on over complicated hybrids. If they belong to the same family: canine, cat, lizard, fish, ursa (bear), horse etc. Then it might not be a hybrid at all and is a new sub species entirely which entitles you to do something that is much cooler then a hybrid in my personal opinion. Which is give it a unique name that represents that sub-species specific traits instead of just it's ancestors species named combines. (Cooler in my opinion because it requires more thought and creativity to come up with a sub species then just 'slap 2 or 3 names together and make it fit')
An arctic wox doesn't sound that presentable, but in my opinion is better then calling it a hybrid so you can use the minus separated notation used for hybrids. If you want to call your sub species an Arctic-Fox-Wolf, fine, be my guest. But not as a hybrid.
Copy cats, duplicates, copies...
I already named it, but I want to emphasize on the fact that I think a character should be unique in some way. Only twins or triplets where the hole gag is on how much they are like each other in my opinion counts as a good character(s). If you straight up rip an existing character from a show, another person or anything else that already exists. Only change the hair color (or something else minor) then you just stoles someones identity. If you are the 'first one' to copy a fictional character from a show or series then that is excusable. Even if you didn't know their are others doing the same.
You just really risk becoming a 1 in a dozen. Watch any anime convention video and you will see multple: Jack Sparrow, Etzio, Iron Man etc.
Which on itself is fine, but we are talking about a fursona. And in my opinion a fursona should tell something about you. If a character is just 1 of X many you have that's fine... But if you identify with 1, then that one shouldn't be a 12 in a dozen unless you have a very specific reason (like with the twins or triplets trope).
It's so easy to make a character stand apart:
- Make him/her the evil/dark version
- The happy version
- The pink one
- The angel after perishing one.
Life changing experience or alternate time lines can easily make up for the lack of unique personality you get when you just copy a character. It is then easy to deduce how the character works, although it might turn in to a cliché quickly. It is still better then just being a copy cat.
Status symbol
Not one species or choice for a character makes YOU a better person (or furry, for that matter). The cats or the wolfs (or insert any species) are NOT better because they choose that race. Yes they could team up, yes they might like each other more just because they choose the same species. However, it's not a status symbol. It doesn't make you more of a person then the guy next to you even if they do not (yet) even have a fursona.
And I would like your all opinion on this view.
Remember, be constructive and polite please.
You might be able to sway my opinion or I might not always agree with you, but I will aspire to stay polite through out.
Jorinda:
--- Quote ---A personal connection
And NOT just a it is a cool/popular thing at the moment. It should represent you and/or represent where you stand for.
--- End quote ---
On the other hand, I've seen enough people making fun of Angel Dragons or corgis because "It's just a fashion thing, not a true fursona". Don't let the fact that the character you love is trendy right now deter you from choosing it.
--- Quote ---Then it's easy to sway the other way from here and say: "let me choose the least popular race". This however isn't the right way to go either. Because it could alienate you (a bit) as no one else can (immediately) identify with you until they have heard your story.
--- End quote ---
I guess seagulls are rather rare, but I've never experienced any alienation.
--- Quote ---Unique
With a quickly growing community in it's easy to pick a popular species or look, but in my opinion a fursona should be you, you are an unique invidiual. Not a 1000 words or a full A4 page of text could define a single person. Not any of us is that bland. So a fursona should not be just another face in the crowd. He, she or it (or other variation) should have some outstanding features that make hem identifiable.
--- End quote ---
On the other hand, I'd rather see another black-white husky or red fox, than someone who tried too hard. Adding wings, horns, spots, stripes,.... it might make your fursona unique, but don't overload your design with too many details and add-ons.
--- Quote ---Nonsensical or over complicated hybrids.
This is a large gray area so bare with me here. With non nonsensical I mean that just combining two races does not necessarily make for an interesting character, especially when the mechanics or anatomy of one race does not at all add up.
--- End quote ---
I agree. I have a pet peeve for things that do not work - like wings that are attached in a position where they could not move at all. I understand that this is illogical - we're talking about phantasy creatures after all - but I prefer species that look like they could be alive with that anatomy.
--- Quote --- Foxes are loners that hunt for easy meals, wolfs pack up and work together to secure a full and tasty meal for a longer period and their whole pack. And lots of other unique traits.
--- End quote ---
Don't restrict yourself to species stereotypes. It is your character after all, it should be more than "it is a cat because I like warmth and sleep a lot".
--- Quote ---Copy cats, duplicates, copies...
You just really risk becoming a 1 in a dozen. Watch any anime convention video and you will see multple: Jack Sparrow, Etzio, Iron Man etc.
--- End quote ---
The ones you named are cosplayers. They try to stay close to an existing design. A fursona can be inspired by an existing design, but the character traits are something each person puts into it.
--- Quote ---It's so easy to make a character stand apart:
- Make him/her the evil/dark version
- The happy version
- The pink one
- The angel after perishing one.
--- End quote ---
Why versions?
My fursona is me. Including the happiness, the sadness, the love, the hate. Including all emotions makes her a whole being.
--- Quote ---Status symbol
Not one species or choice for a character makes YOU a better person (or furry, for that matter). The cats or the wolfs (or insert any species) are NOT better because they choose that race. Yes they could team up, yes they might like each other more just because they choose the same species. However, it's not a status symbol. It doesn't make you more of a person then the guy next to you even if they do not (yet) even have a fursona.
--- End quote ---
Nah, we have fursuits for that :P
Fineas:
--- Quote from: Jorinda on 27.05.2015, 10:45:18 ---On the other hand, I've seen enough people making fun of Angel Dragons or corgis because "It's just a fashion thing, not a true fursona". Don't let the fact that the character you love is trendy right now deter you from choosing it.
--- End quote ---
I haven't seen that, but if that happens I hope it stops. It's painful enough that we get so much heat from the internet in this fandom compared to other groups like Trekkies and Otaku (anime).
But I agree, if you feel that it fits do it. But do not chose it JUST because it's popular.
--- Quote from: Jorinda on 27.05.2015, 10:45:18 ---I guess seagulls are rather rare, but I've never experienced any alienation.
--- End quote ---
I admit that I do not meet a lot of avian species, but I was thinking about real obscure animals or creatures, JUST to make your character stand out.
Like amoeba or a black-surface mole from planet Serian in the Mass Effect universe.
Again, just choosing either both ends of the spectrum JUST to stand out is bad if that is the base for your character.
However, everyone should feel free to experiment. And if choosing a popular race/species as a starting point. Then by all means :-3
--- Quote from: Jorinda on 27.05.2015, 10:45:18 ---On the other hand, I'd rather see another black-white husky or red fox, than someone who tried too hard. Adding wings, horns, spots, stripes,.... it might make your fursona unique, but don't overload your design with too many details and add-ons.
--- End quote ---
It has to start somewhere, you have a point their :-3
--- Quote from: Jorinda on 27.05.2015, 10:45:18 ---I agree. I have a pet peeve for things that do not work - like wings that are attached in a position where they could not move at all. I understand that this is illogical - we're talking about phantasy creatures after all - but I prefer species that look like they could be alive with that anatomy.
--- End quote ---
Makes them that more interesting if you can with ease imagine them in their 'natural habitat/environment' doing their thing :-3
--- Quote from: Jorinda on 27.05.2015, 10:45:18 ---Don't restrict yourself to species stereotypes. It is your character after all, it should be more than "it is a cat because I like warmth and sleep a lot".
--- End quote ---
I agree to some point, but ... just don't over do it. Unless your intent is to make a character that acts very out-of-character like... a balerina T-rex that picks flowers. Or a lovely little bunny with a enormous bite (Montey Python reference).
I just in general recommend following some established bases and work from their.
Lions, foxes and hyenas are in general very opportunistic and do not give up or back down easily. However, maybe your character hasn't matured or has had a very intense situation that made them shy and act out less with that behavior.
That makes a character in my opinion. A stereotypical character that has no unique traits is just a sheep in the herd. If you see 5 in a row and can't tell them apart then it's just no fun. So yes, unique characters traits are important, but going to far could break 'the fourth wall'.
--- Quote from: Jorinda on 27.05.2015, 10:45:18 ---The ones you named are cosplayers. They try to stay close to an existing design. A fursona can be inspired by an existing design, but the character traits are something each person puts into it.
--- End quote ---
Yes, that is so. I also see people that carry multiple fursonas... I kind of see where they are going with that. I have multiple characters myself.
But then again, I just have 1 name and character (with everything connected) that I use as a main. To 'advertise/interact' with in the real world.
I see him as my fursona.
--- Quote from: Jorinda on 27.05.2015, 10:45:18 ---Why versions?
My fursona is me. Including the happiness, the sadness, the love, the hate. Including all emotions makes her a whole being.
--- End quote ---
I agree. I but I was thinking about ... making an existing character stand out more. So if you already are Simabe from the Lion King for example.
But find out later that as the fandom grows that a guy from Ukrain or Spain or Japan suddenly coming in to the fandom, having exactly the same character.
They are based on an existing character. So you could both have identified with them in the same way, used their name and exactly the same traits.
But IF the original owner doesn't care you copy them. For instance I'm pretty sure Disney doesn't care if you copy them as long as you do not become a public figure or try to sell any likeness of 'yourself' within that role/character. Then add something that makes this character stand apart.
You could off course continue with this orginal. But their will be confusion as soon as people start to meet you both and not even mentioning paper work while dealing with official affairs.
So that was just my recommendation. Not just to make a different version of your fursona because you can. But just to add something unique to them.
--- Quote from: Jorinda on 27.05.2015, 10:45:18 ---Nah, we have fursuits for that :P
--- End quote ---
Hehe, never looked at it that way really :-3
VickyVixen:
I love this post, although I haven't had a real concrete fursona for a couple of years now.
I just can't find any animal or hybrid to identify with. There are many copycats out there, but I wonder whether it's really a problem to portray just another orange fox.
Many people do so, but perhaps it's a consequence of the lack of resources available to help you find your fursona. Strange quizzes with questions such as: "Do you like playing with wool?" shouldn't really have to decide for you that you're a cat or perhaps a sheep.
I guess you could show those who are looking for a fursona the endless possibilities, but that may sometimes seem very overwhelming.
I don't have many tips, but if anyone does, feel free to post it here.
???
Fineas:
Only real advice I can give you is, let yourself be inspired.
Look at pictures or other media: movies, series, games, books etc
Then when you spot someone or something you like. Write down (or make a mental note) what you like about them.
Try to divide them in to groups:
- Esthetics's (how they look)
- Personality (how they are like)
- Behaviorisms (how they act)
- Their personal preferences and dislikes
Then when you got a good couple of things... Like between 3 and 8 things for each.
Then just pick the animal you like and imagine them with those traits.
At which you might feel their is stuff missing.
- Like if they are are a hellraiser then they might have a scar or just one functional eye (because of the fighting and unneeded head first approaches).
- If they are sweet they might carry a bow or ear rings or heart shaped figures on their body.
- If they are nature loving the might carry a flower and might have a butterfly/bird friend always around (like a duo).
From their it's just see what sticks.
I had the luck that I asked a talented artist to make a badge for me. I gave her some rough outlines on how I wanted him to be. And she delivered this on the first try.
Needless to say I was stunned. Still, it needed time to grow on me, but over time you either like them more or you start to dislike parts of em and know what you want to change.
So you can use that as a base to let them make a new picture.
This last part is easiest in roleplay. When you put them in a story and stuff starts happening you slowly start to reason like your character and then you start feeling things that either feel unnatural or wrong. Which will give you clues in what things are important to you to the point you need to incorporate them in a character.
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