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Author Topic: Opinion about this years pawpet show  (Read 23736 times)

Fineas

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Re: Opinion about this years pawpet show
« Reply #30 on: 23.08.2011, 23:40:14 »

Wow... after reading all that I almost feel ashamed to say anything bad at all.

For starters. I really liked this years Pawpet show. My favorite is EF 15, because it felt like a couple of stories in one. The theme spoke to me, the first time I saw the main cast and I just love Mika. Really skipped heartbeats when she got shot, and even more when I thought she wouldn't survive.

I'm going to try not to repeat any one else, so apart from some small things that are unavoidable and a couple that have gone wrong because of the incredible short rehearsal time. I really loved the show. A completely new cast build just for this show, awesome characters (the daughter lost some credit with me by being so incredibly stubborn and devastatingly rude) so the transition to hurt, sweet and loving felt a bit to sudden. Still, it was a clever scene, really heart touching. And I hear people complaining about the heads they saw all the time, but I don't hear people saying how AWSOME those quadruple animals looked. The moves they could do with walking, jumping etc just looked amazing.

As far for storytelling goes, I feel you couldn't have changed anything without compromising in other departments. If their was more humor the message wouldn't have come over. If their was less aggression, the conflict wouldn't have worked.

I have 1 comment that bothered me for the storytelling part.
The dragon at the end scene was on the run for days, taken captive, tortured and then taken under automated fire. Still he was able to easily over throw his wife and didn't looked hurt at all. Sorry, but it feels a bit Dues Ex Machinae. If he would have been weazing or just dropped his hurt body over her it would have felt more appropriate. (But maybe that would have been impossible seeying they where both operated by 3 people and you where already pretty close together, so I see why you might not have been able too)

And I have a question.
- The shopkeeper that fixed the telephone made a joke at the end of the scene, so everyone was laughing. But, I thought I heard a shot. So... did he get shot?

That's all. All criticism aside, I sat through the whole show only left the second pauze for a beer. I didn't want a miss a second. And it has been worth it. I respect the medium and understand it's limitations. You are masters in your own right bringing us yet again with an amazing story, backdrops, puppets, video, props and music that you produced just for this years convention. I find it incredible. Thank you yet again for a wonderful experience.
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Fairlight

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Re: Opinion about this years pawpet show
« Reply #31 on: 24.08.2011, 00:58:04 »

Yes, the poor shopkeeper got shot... The sound effects for it played after lights out, tho.
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Riffuchs

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Re: Opinion about this years pawpet show
« Reply #32 on: 24.08.2011, 02:19:28 »

This pawpetshow I liked a lot. The 'new characters"' did fit nicely into the story. It had both universal and some theme specific humor in it (like "Hello World" and "There's more than one way to do it"). The plotline was foreseeable now and then but it was fun to watch what ways it would go to end up like suspected. And, most important, it didn't felt like another episode where character interaction and jokes may also be forseeable.

It was fun to watch how so many different elements (the story taking place on stage, the predited video material, prerecordes samples and so on) fall into place so smoothly.

The scene that I will never forget was the one where the shop keeper got shot while the sceen had already ended "on stage". He was just a poor guy that had no part in the big scheme but was just unfortunate to meet the wrong people at the wrong time and the way he died portrayed how unimportant one can be. He was just a sidekick char and died just like that, he has just some minutes on stage and thefore killing him was for the 'bad guys' as easy as he was unimportant.

I took me the whole next scene to process the thoughs it stired until I could keep track of the show again.
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Yours sincerely,
Riffuchs

CleanerWolf

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Re: Opinion about this years pawpet show
« Reply #33 on: 24.08.2011, 02:25:20 »

I liked the Pawpet Show. At first I was wondering about the absence of the well known main characters, but then I understood, why the PPS team was trying something new and it was refreshing.

My favorite character was Null the white rabbit. It was very noticable how much fun Eisfuchs had, bringing him to live. I also liked the other characters of course. In the last years there was a tendency to bring more and more custom build puppets into the show and this year, the PPS team raised that kind of art to a new level. My jaw dropped when I noticed, that the four-legged characters were able to close their eye lids. So many details, so many love and effort were put into those puppets. I was really impressed.

My favorite scene was the "Flynn's" nightclub scene. "You broke the sim!"  ;D
Some people already complained about the absence of any ending song. I would have liked a more "epic" ending too, it was a bit weak compared to previous shows, but Null's monologue compensated it somehow, because I really liked the message he had to tell.    

The story delivered a good balance of humor and drama. Maybe it was a little bit too technical for some people in some moments with all the h4x0rs tricks.

Overall it was a very entertaining show and I enjoyed it.

Oh... and always remember: "The sky is the limit !"  :)
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Cheetah

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Re: Opinion about this years pawpet show
« Reply #34 on: 24.08.2011, 15:02:22 »

Wow... after reading all that I almost feel ashamed to say anything bad at all.

Naah, that's fine. So far most criticism has been on a pretty sophisticated level ... really, if what people are criticising here for the most part is really the only things they can think of, I think we're getting away pretty well this year :) And we know it's impossible to appeal to everyone.

Quote
And I hear people complaining about the heads they saw all the time, but I don't hear people saying how AWSOME those quadruple animals looked. The moves they could do with walking, jumping etc just looked amazing.

Thank you! We were a little bit amazed how versatile they turned out to be. When we tried them out for the first time, we were very worried if we would be able to play them convincingly, and believe me ... we're our own biggest critics in that regard :) And we had some serious issues to overcome with proportions, height, and the body sized of our actors! Pan had to wear 10cm high platform boots, and Yun (the golden tiger) had to be retrofitted with reinforced rubber bands in her back so she could hold her head high all the time. And coordinating three people to move four paws, head/jaw/eyes/tail and moving the body at the same time was quite a challenge too. Especially furing the fighting/running/jumping. People got themselves quite a few bruises and scratches during the rehearsals.

(I don't think that anyone has ever tried playing a quadruped puppet from below yet. I've seen it done "black screen" style with puppeteers playing the puppets on the ground, or as marionettes ... but not handpuppet-style from below)

The more am I happy to read that people liked how they moved :)

Quote
I have 1 comment that bothered me for the storytelling part.
The dragon at the end scene was on the run for days, taken captive, tortured and then taken under automated fire. Still he was able to easily over throw his wife and didn't looked hurt at all. Sorry, but it feels a bit Dues Ex Machinae.

Yeah, I admit, making the dragon virtually indistructable was a bit too obviously a plot device. There are a lot of directions in the script to hint at how hurt he actually is, but then ... I guess it didn't quite come across in the end.

Just for fun, I'll give you a little glimpse into the writing process that lead to this situation:

You can't imagine how many times the ending scene has been re-written to make it work somehow :) Originally we were planning to have a real played-out ending, with everyone escaping from the roof before Jiao-Chan even arrives. Cai-Lung was supposed to fly away from the rooftop, taking Cornelius and Yun with him. Then Jiao-Chan was supposed to have the final dialogue with Null, and then Null would take over control and the story would be over.

Later in the production, when the puppets were being built, we realized that Cai-Lung carrying other puppets and flying away was impossible to play. So our "heroes" had to stay on the roof and face Jiao-Chan - which is problematic, because she's got like, a private army behind her. So we re-wrote the story into what it finally turned out to be: Jiao Chan lost her support from the government because she disobeyed the orders of her superiours and decided to go after Cai-Lung herself. So in the end, she shows up on the roof alone. But how do you take down a tigress with a gun without shooting her first? So we came up with Cai-Lung just taking the hits and then basically just dominating Jiao-Chan ... and that was the ending that you got to see.

(By the way, some bits of the original ending are still in there. Like, Cornelius asking "You're a dragon. You can fly, right?". You can spot more if you listen closely :) )

Quote
- The shopkeeper that fixed the telephone made a joke at the end of the scene, so everyone was laughing. But, I thought I heard a shot. So... did he get shot?

Yes. And I was a bit surprised that people laughed! It was totally not meant to be funny. It was supposed to be tragic! The man's a hero, and he probably knew a lot more about what was going on than he admitted. He was a very close friend of Null.

Quote
That's all. All criticism aside, I sat through the whole show only left the second pauze for a beer. I didn't want a miss a second. And it has been worth it. I respect the medium and understand it's limitations. You are masters in your own right bringing us yet again with an amazing story, backdrops, puppets, video, props and music that you produced just for this years convention. I find it incredible. Thank you yet again for a wonderful experience.

You're more than welcome. I'm happy we were able to give you a great time. That's what we're here for after all :)
« Last Edit: 24.08.2011, 15:06:50 by Cheetah »
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Cheetah

Thygrrr

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Re: Opinion about this years pawpet show
« Reply #35 on: 24.08.2011, 15:22:47 »

We (at least I) were laughing because the shopkeeper was so badass and cool about sacrificing himself.

It was the kind of laugh you get when you see something really crass.
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Druon

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Re: Opinion about this years pawpet show
« Reply #36 on: 24.08.2011, 15:31:30 »

I guess to some extend the audience didn't believe the henchman to be actually that tough. Before the shopkeeper incident we mostly saw them as cuddly, ebil, little animals, always missing everything with their oversized plastic guns. And getting yelled at by their bossy tigress a lot. They seemd to be the typical parody villain henchmen.

So having them actually kill someone in that fashion was a bit of a shocker and people didn't already see it coming.
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Fineas

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Re: Opinion about this years pawpet show
« Reply #37 on: 24.08.2011, 17:24:58 »


- The shopkeeper that fixed the telephone made a joke at the end of the scene, so everyone was laughing. But, I thought I heard a shot. So... did he get shot?

Yes. And I was a bit surprised that people laughed! It was totally not meant to be funny. It was supposed to be tragic! The man's a hero, and he probably knew a lot more about what was going on than he admitted. He was a very close friend of Null.

We (at least I) were laughing because the shopkeeper was so badass and cool about sacrificing himself.

It was the kind of laugh you get when you see something really crass.

For me it really felt in between. I laughed at first. Then realized, damn this guy is putting his life on the line, why am I laughing? And then I heard the shot, but wasn't sure if it was one. So I felt aggravated, confused and relieved at the same time.

I think it has to do with timing.
The gun fight, escape and the foes entering the shop where hero just goes static saying like an every day "This is ... electronics, how can I help you."
Maybe if a second or 3 would have passed some suspense would have been created that would breathed that tension and drama you wanted. Everyone probably felt surprised, aggravated by the fight and relieved by the escape to realize another drama finished that scene.
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Cheetah

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Re: Opinion about this years pawpet show
« Reply #38 on: 24.08.2011, 17:25:25 »

Yeah, druon, I think you have a point. I've never looked at it that way.
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Cheetah

Ziggy_wolf

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Re: Opinion about this years pawpet show
« Reply #39 on: 24.08.2011, 18:24:17 »

I was actually expecting a goofy muppet like show, and wasn't expecting anything near the degree of profesionalism I saw at the show. The story was really well written, the characters beleivable and overall way better than what I was expecting.
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Rua Whitepaw

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Re: Opinion about this years pawpet show
« Reply #40 on: 24.08.2011, 18:26:32 »

That was what I first expected as well when I went to EF 13. I only knew the funday pawpet show so I was expecting a comedy show. But now I look forward to the pawpet show every time. It's so amazing what they do...
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Skie

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Re: Opinion about this years pawpet show
« Reply #41 on: 24.08.2011, 18:39:16 »

The show was pretty good, like always.
I don't have much to say about the new changes (i.e. the quads), I'm mostly neutral about them.

It's pretty hard for me to judge those shows, as for me nothing can seem to beat Dreamcatchers.
People really have different opinions as well. I didn't like the EF15 one too much, but really did like EF16 one (snake NOM scene was epic).

One strong new point I'd like to point out is the good use of videos in the intermissions and null's box. That was pretty good and we should see more of the same :)

Thanks you again for putting you time and effort in brining us an amazing show, and there's really only one question left to ask...

When will we see a Dreamcatchers DVD available? :P


« Last Edit: 24.08.2011, 18:41:12 by Skie »
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ysegrim

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Re: Opinion about this years pawpet show
« Reply #42 on: 25.08.2011, 00:10:37 »

We (at least I) were laughing because the shopkeeper was so badass and cool about sacrificing himself.

Besides, the laughter started before the shot could be heard (actually, at the last line from the shop keeper), so people at first did not expect (and later, most probably won't have heard) the shot. Esp. as the stage was dark already when it happened.
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Zefiro

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Re: Opinion about this years pawpet show
« Reply #43 on: 25.08.2011, 00:56:58 »

It was never explicitely stated in the script that he's shot-dead - just the usual "bad guys shoot and miss" at first and then the final sound fx after the lights-out-cue. I personally like to think he survived.

From reading the feedback I get it that it's contradicting request from different sides, some wanting more depth and meaning, others more light-hearted fun and no message. I've got a personal opinion on this, too, but I leave it to our director and script writers to try the balance act to make as much of our audience happy as they can. And for those who dislike some aspects, I hope they could at least enjoy the other parts of the show :)


As for the video intermissions, we're trying to get as much acting live on stage and use pre-recorded audio only when absolutely necessary (not having enough microphones for minor characters is our usual reason). Shifting time played to video aka pre-recordings wouldn't be the same as performing on stage, and ultimately we do not want to create a pawpet-show-movie, but a live show. Also, creating the videos was a lot of effort, and then still some say that they are too short as they don't bridge the full pause. I'm sorry, but for me this would be a reason to go back to audio-only again.


As for the amount of props, indeed it appears that we had not so many and perhaps less sophisticated props this year. We still had quite an amount of props, though most of them weren't those which are on the playrail anymore, but hold / shown by the puppets, e.g. the usb-stick, id-card, pizza boxes, big red buttons, weapons, VR-helmets, sparkling cable, cellphone, stuff in the storage chamber near the security gate, etc.

We nearly doubled our nominal man-power this year, drawing in help from whereever we could and whoever was willing to lend a paw. We had quite some special effects and big stuff to build: five custom and big characters which needed special mechanics (the dragon even electrics) to work, new technical challanges like slanted panels (which are not that easy and also one of the reasons for longer scene breaks), and the whole "Null Box" i.e. a small second stage where Null was played live and which we build from ground up, backdrop and electronics and video. Add to that the usual SFX gimmicks like flickering lanterns from above, the sparkling cable from Null or the magical glow in Voids paws when his memory kicks back in and you might see why we indeed need a full column of conbook-credits-listing and still couldn't build the previous amount of "standard boring props" :)


I personally are VERY HAPPY with this years show, both with the script and our final performance, and I'd like to really THANK YOU for being such a great audience.

*purrrr*
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Ragear

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Re: Opinion about this years pawpet show
« Reply #44 on: 25.08.2011, 03:08:55 »

Hi everybody,

I'd like to chip in my opinion, too, though most has been said already, but...
This was my first EF, my furst pawpetshow, so I can't compare it to something else. I had no idea what it was about (yeah, pawpets, what can you do with them but make some children cheer, great deal), what was about to come my way, someone mentioned everybody cried 2 years ago, no way bugger.

Fellows, THIS WAS THE MOST F***G AWESOME THING that ever caught me by surprise. Period. My arse may have gotten heavy over the time, but this was way beyond worthwile. I wont get into nitty details, but thank you for enriching my life with this show, this was breathtaking. I'm still fighting back emotions while typing this. I even didn't get all the references and cameos! Null's statement at the end may have been written by either M. Gandhi or M. L. King alike, but no less true. And standing ovations is something I haven't seen for a very long time. Pray do carry on with this. I just hope I don't get too jaded to appreciate all this heart, all this work, all this attention going into this work of art.

Thank you for listening to me and good night

Ragear
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