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Eurofurence 25 "Fractures in Time" - Estrel Hotel Berlin, August 14-18, 2019Follow eurofurence on Twitter

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Author Topic: various feedback  (Read 6443 times)

Fafnir Kristensen

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various feedback
« on: 23.08.2011, 11:48:46 »

everything said here reflect my own opinion, I tried to be objective as much as possible but some of my comment may hurt some feeling, I apologies beforehand if thats the case. 

pro:
(almost) in time all the time!!!!!!
that was superawesome, really, it was almost getting a sort of german feeling ^_^

I wasnt there last year so I discovered the new hotel this year, I dont know who got the idea of the disco ball but that was adding a really amazing and unique feeling to the whole place. if you tell me who he/she is I will buy him/her a beer next year. also the standee and the huge dragon and illustrated banners were great.

thanks for the improvised fursuite parade on sunday.

thanks for all the hard work of all the people making this event possible.
I dont think I can really grasp the full extend of everything thats being done to put everything together but it is must be simply overwhelming.
great great thank you to every people involved.

I hope the guy who got hurt trying to fix the sound (?) console after the beer incident is better. a really big kudo to him to finishing to fix it after what happened, respect.


con:
the Fursuit Friendly Dance way very very very disappointing. I went a few time but the music didnt really make me want to stay, and from what many of my fursuiter friends told me, it was the same for them.
I would be interested to know how DJ Kenai does his mix choice? did he talk to fursuiter to ask them the kind of music they like to dance on? if yes maybe he should enlarge the set of fursuiter he ask.
dont get me wrong, Im grateful to DJ Kenai to take time and energy to mix, as it does add to the entertainment of the whole convention, Im just saying it may be improved.
also, please, I know it may be annoying to stay put on the light mix table, but dont get drunk. too much smoke and strob dont get well when you are in a fursuite (also reported by my friends fursuiters).

putting the Fursuit Group Photo and Parade the "morning" after the Fursuit Friendly Dance means many fursuiter didnt go to the dance to not be too tired and be able to wake up and participate to the Photo and Parade.

also, I know it is simply impossible to foresee the meteo when the con planing is set, but if it's raining like that, cant the Parade be shifted to another moment in the day or some other day?

as far as I know, there was no open-ended event on friday evening.
I know this may have caused some problem with security, but ambiance in the improvised party on the balcony in the hotel lobby was quite fun. (thanks security to have played smooth with it)


other:
just a feeling but maybe putting the art auction on saturday means people were less stressed/tired and hence less prompt to bid, meaning also fewer and lower bids. it ended also quite quickly (though this may also bee caused by lesser artpieces getting auctioned due to the difficult economical situation and such)
but then, maybe Oncle Kage appreciated he could attend his next panel without being late ;)


42: ELEVATORS ARE EVIL!!!!! EVERYWHERE !!!!!
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karpour

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Re: various feedback
« Reply #1 on: 23.08.2011, 12:31:08 »

I'm sorry the fursuit friendly dance didn't comply with your personal music taste, but in general I heard noone complaining about anything. I found the dance was perfect for fursuiters, with cheesy and not-too-fast bouncy music. Also the dancefloor was very full which leads to my conclusion that a lot of people have enjoyed it :)
I think Kenai did a great job and I'm looking forward to the next fursuit dance :D
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Fafnir Kristensen

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Re: various feedback
« Reply #2 on: 23.08.2011, 12:45:58 »

the dancefloor was very far from being full everytime I went to give it another try, but maybe I just missed it
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Thygrrr

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Re: various feedback
« Reply #3 on: 23.08.2011, 13:03:32 »

An important fact is: You don't have to go to the dances, obviously.

I think here's what it all boils down to:
  • the average furs go to dances a couple of times a year
  • the average DJ produces music much more frequently
  • DJ's taste and sophistication in music evolves much more rapidly, together with their scene
  • other furs stay in the past with their tastes for much longer, meaning they can't appreciate the newer stuff the DJ's play

(removed some statements about style choice because they could spark an unwanted discussion... sowwy, Cheetah)
« Last Edit: 23.08.2011, 13:36:06 by Thygrrr »
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Thygrrr Darkfurre

Cheetah

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Re: various feedback
« Reply #4 on: 23.08.2011, 13:16:09 »

Okay ... I really hate to say it, but I will allow feedback about everything, but NO DISCUSSION ABOUT MUSICIAL STYLES.


The attendance of the dances was comparable to what we had last year, and it was the same style of music that has worked countless times at other occasions with a comparable audience.

I can understand that there are people out there who don't like this kind of music. But we won't be able to change that. Our DJs have more than 10 years of experience in furry club dances and furry convention dances. They are getting very immediate feedback from the crowd on the floor. They know what they are doing. The only choice they have is to try and find the lowest common denominator, and I'm afraid ... for some that might turn out just too low - unavoidable law of statistics.

I will lock all discussions about musicial preferences from now on ... because it is really pointless to publicly argue about whose musicial taste is to be considered canon and whose isn't. We've had this discussion since we're having dances, and it never lead to any useful insights on any side.

Feel free to privately send our DJs an email what your likes and dislikes were.
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Cheetah

djem

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Re: various feedback
« Reply #5 on: 23.08.2011, 13:21:11 »

Quote
also, please, I know it may be annoying to stay put on the light mix table, but dont get drunk. too much smoke and strob dont get well when you are in a fursuite

Sorry, but if you think I'm gonna sit and just watch people having fun, then you don't know me :D And while I might have been drunk, I was far away from beying wasted and still completly able to do my job :)  The smoke level was from my point the correct one, and strob light use in the corect way, didin't you recently went to any night club or party ? Strob are almost now uses as general ambiant light ;)
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Fafnir Kristensen

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Re: various feedback
« Reply #6 on: 23.08.2011, 13:31:22 »

I was just reporting what my friend fursuiters told me, now you do what you want with it, ignore it or take it into account, your choice.

now what about my other points ?
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djem

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Re: various feedback
« Reply #7 on: 23.08.2011, 15:09:42 »

I was just reporting what my friend fursuiters told me, now you do what you want with it, ignore it or take it into account, your choice.

Of course I take note of it, don't get me wrong, and will talk about that with the rest of te stage crew ;)
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Cairyn

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Re: various feedback
« Reply #8 on: 23.08.2011, 15:20:07 »

just a feeling but maybe putting the art auction on saturday means people were less stressed/tired and hence less prompt to bid, meaning also fewer and lower bids. it ended also quite quickly (though this may also bee caused by lesser artpieces getting auctioned due to the difficult economical situation and such)
but then, maybe Oncle Kage appreciated he could attend his next panel without being late ;)

There are certainly a number of things that influence the duration of the auction.

Actually, we increased the number of bids-to-auction on Uncle Kage's request to keep the duration of the auction in check (last year's auction had too many pieces), so a shorter auction was the goal. The two hours in the timetable are a maximum duration since we cannot tell in advance how many pieces will make it to the auction, and as you said, Uncle Kage has events to attend after the auction, too (also, sales happen immediately after). That said, we did count the items that would have made it to the auction after last year's rules (8 bids to auction) - which would have been only 11 pieces more; all in all the numbers were far below last year's auction even if you exclude the charity items.

There was also the factor that some artists ask for a higher starting price now (rather accepting unsold pieces than selling for minimum bid far below value), since the strategy "I start with a low minimum bid and hope people will get into a bidding war" has repeatedly failed with such a large selection of art for sale which gives buyers plenty of options. This certainly makes for more satisfying sales for artists, but the buyer interest will be more likely be settled on the bidsheet and not carry a piece to auction.

But it was also apparent that buyers were more cautious and thrifty with their money, going only for a selected few pieces (which still made top money). So yes, the bidding and the height of the bids probably have been hit by the ongoing economical crisis. Myself, I have definitely bought less stuff than in previous years (although I was seriously tempted by some beautiful and expressive art).
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Cheetah

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Re: various feedback
« Reply #9 on: 23.08.2011, 15:23:59 »

I was just reporting what my friend fursuiters told me, now you do what you want with it, ignore it or take it into account, your choice.

now what about my other points ?

They are being noted, and taken very seriously. (Like we did last year's feedback here in the forum. I hope it was noticeable how much little things we have been able to improve thanks to the criticisms here in the forum.)  However, I'm leaving it to the people in charge for the respective departments to decide if they want to comment on it or not :) Anyways thank you very much for your input.
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davuu

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Re: various feedback
« Reply #10 on: 23.08.2011, 17:42:44 »



pros

I enjoyed the dances, they had a diverse selection of music to keep you bouncing, the fans were great and powerful and cooled you down sufficiently enough to go bouncing on the dance floor again:) the strobe lighting I personnally found was fun, and I didnt have a problem with smoke I thought it added to the atmosphere. Person in the big silver hat I danced with a few times, im not sure how you maintained your jumping up and down energy for every dance!:p  and thanks to the person sat on the chair near the fans, who directed the fans onto hot suiters, was thoughtful:)

I liked the sing along in the piano bar, was amusing to listen to inbetween bouncing around the BigBlueDance :)

The fursuit lounge was well organised and spacious so when lots of suiters were in there cooling down it didnt get hot and stuffy. I appreciated staff(?) in the fursuit lounge filling up pre-made cups of drinks and straws so suiters could just come and grab one quickly of they were hot.  They also made sure suiters were ok, and helped them when needed so well done fursuit lounge:) Allso well done to the temporary firsuit lounge at the dead dog party, that was very much appreciated:)

The hotel itself was great, the room cleaners seemed to be relaxed and know that people had late nights before, and generally left people alone and cleaned the rooms in the afternoons, this was appreciated after some dances:) so well done to them.

The bar staff were great, and I know Codewolf did a collection for them. They took pictures of themselves with some of the suiters and didnt mind when someones ears accidentally knocked off and smashed a row of glasses! they were fun and happy throughout the con.
The hotel was big and well organised, and had plenty of spaces if you wanted to hang out with friends or just have some quiet time.
I enjoyed the PawPet show, and it showed alot of effort went into it all:) Thankyou to Shay for finding me a seat after mine got pinched during the interval.

Overall was great, was fun to meet new people and spend time with all my friends old and new:)

Now the cons.....

Almost getting abducted in suit by drunk numptys who decided I was male and  tried to take me to their room *to be naughty*  luckily I managed to run off from them and got someone to escort me to the lift to my room where I de-suited.  No means no!

Not being allowed in to see Bitter Lake after a massive hold up with our dinner meant we were 5-10 minutes late.  People on the door wouldn’t let us in saying it was too disruptive, they wouldn’t even let us in through the back entrance (fursuit lounge)  telling us if we wanted to see it now we would have to buy it on DVD.  Really not happy with this as wanted to support a friend by watching his film, and had been looking forward to it alot from the trailers.  There were no signs up anywhere saying if you weren’t here on time you couldn’t come in.  I’d understand if it was half way through but 5-10 minutes?! We weren’t the only ones there were alot of people in the same position.
I decided to take the opportunity of an empty swimming pool, but on my way up one of my group noticed that security were letting their friends in through the back! Talk about rubbing salt to the wounds! He rushed back and got them to let him in but I was already changed for swimming, so missed it.  I know this wasn’t Shays fault.

Told the parade was cancelled due to the weather so didn’t suit, only for it to then go off late.

At the dead dog dance,  I had a problem  and needed to go to the fursuit lounge asap, only to find it full of non suiters talking and I couldn’t physically get into the room, despite asking them to please move they just stood there  against all the fans, have some respect.  I ended up having to go back to the bar and find someone to help me.

Overall summary, for my first con it was great and I hope to come back next year:)
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Nightwind005

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Re: various feedback
« Reply #11 on: 23.08.2011, 17:54:59 »

I have nothing but cons almost for this con, i enjoyed it very much so and im happy i could leave back home knowing i did almost eveything

Thou only a few cons

im a bit upset i couldn't get in the fur-suit photography, even thou i saw someones name like 3 times in one go i was devastated.

also where can i make a complaint about somone abusing the dealer den system? as i know someone who just sat at a tale and drew for product :/ in the dealers den of all places
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Dhary Montecore

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Re: various feedback
« Reply #12 on: 23.08.2011, 17:58:37 »

Almost getting abducted in suit by drunk numptys who decided I was male and  tried to take me to their room *to be naughty*  luckily I managed to run off from them and got someone to escort me to the lift to my room where I de-suited.  No means no!

I'm honestly outraged about the fact that we didn't get any complaint about this. Is there any way for you to find out the Names or any other means of identification?

Not being allowed in to see Bitter Lake after a massive hold up with our dinner meant we were 5-10 minutes late.  People on the door wouldn’t let us in saying it was too disruptive, they wouldn’t even let us in through the back entrance (fursuit lounge)  telling us if we wanted to see it now we would have to buy it on DVD.  [...]

I'm terribly sorry about this incident. The problem was, that the security detail at the doors had the explicit order not to let anyone disturb the movie screening after the movie started. Also it isn't allowed to let any non-suiters walk into (and also through) the fursuitlounge, so they wouldn't let anyone in as they were ordered to.

After about 5 minutes after the movie started I left the main stage and after a while I heard that delayed furs wanted to get in and I gave clearance to our security at the doors to let people go in through the back entrance in the fursuitlounge as long as a member of security escorted them. I assure you that had nothing to do with friends, since I accompanied the first few furs myself through the lounge and I didn't know anyone of them.

I'm really sorry for this.
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davuu

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Re: various feedback
« Reply #13 on: 23.08.2011, 18:07:59 »


Unfortunately I didnt see any lanyards on them or badges so im not entirely sure they were furs, I was also told later that there were two stag parties going on who were somewhat rowdy and coming into the hotel so it may have been some of them.  I did go back down and have a look for them when I de suited so I could point them out to con-ops but I couldnt find them.

I did keep looking for them the rest of the con and got people to escort me places in suit to be careful.

In terms of Bitter Lake, I can see the point of view that you didnt want the movie disturbed every 5 minutes by late people, it was just frustrating.  Also in terms of the friends thing, apologise if I got that wrong:) just seemed like that due to being told no, and then someone turns up and gets let straight in.  no hard feelings:)
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Dhary Montecore

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Re: various feedback
« Reply #14 on: 23.08.2011, 18:19:56 »

Unfortunately I didnt see any lanyards on them or badges so im not entirely sure they were furs, I was also told later that there were two stag parties going on who were somewhat rowdy and coming into the hotel so it may have been some of them.  I did go back down and have a look for them when I de suited so I could point them out to con-ops but I couldnt find them.
I did keep looking for them the rest of the con and got people to escort me places in suit to be careful.

That's too bad. If by any chance you get more information about that or if anyone else had a similar experience, please contact eurofurence security as soon as possible. Such behavior will not be tolerated!

In terms of Bitter Lake, I can see the point of view that you didnt want the movie disturbed every 5 minutes by late people, it was just frustrating.  Also in terms of the friends thing, apologise if I got that wrong:) just seemed like that due to being told no, and then someone turns up and gets let straight in.  no hard feelings:)

Don't worry, no offense taken. It just saddens me a bit, since all our work and all our effort is only aimed at making sure you folks have a good time at our convention so I take ever little unhappy fur personal. :3 Gyroplast and myself will look into such things more carefully to try and avoid such situations in the future. :3
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James The Dog

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Re: various feedback
« Reply #15 on: 24.08.2011, 02:29:39 »

the Fursuit Friendly Dance way very very very disappointing. I went a few time but the music didnt really make me want to stay, and from what many of my fursuiter friends told me, it was the same for them.

I can only disagree here, I personally loved the music during the fursuit friendly dance. I was a lot less keen on the music during the Big Blue Dance, but it's a matter of personal taste, so I'm not going to complain! I'm sure plenty of people liked it as much as I liked the Thursday dance, and I still enjoyed it anyway.

Another thing I liked about the dances were the animations that were shown on the big screen, it would be great if you started selling a DVD of them, I'd definately buy it!
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Gyroplast

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Re: various feedback
« Reply #16 on: 24.08.2011, 14:17:37 »

In terms of Bitter Lake, I can see the point of view that you didnt want the movie disturbed every 5 minutes by late people, it was just frustrating.  Also in terms of the friends thing, apologise if I got that wrong:) just seemed like that due to being told no, and then someone turns up and gets let straight in.  no hard feelings:)

I can chime in here, as I was at the door most of the time by pure chance, to catch a breath. As was already said, it's frustratingly annoying for people watching a dimly lit stage event like the Pawpet Show or a movie with people coming in late, or worse, just peeking in, and not even closing the door properly afterwards. That's why we decided to close the doors for good after the show started, and considering how people were trickling in every bloody minute, up to 30(!) minutes after the movie actually started, it was a necessary thing to do.

Now, to be honest, it simply didn't occur to me to use the back entrance to the stage until someone pointed out that option to me. Derp! This didn't interrupt the movie too much, and we began escorting people to the back of the stage, where the last few remaining seats were, anyway.

I'm sorry if it appeared as some sort of shady deal to you. I can assure you it wasn't. We merely found an alternative to let people in that we didn't think of before.

Either way, we'll have to announce such specifics somewhere the next time, to make sure people know that they're required to be there on time, or else get no chance to attend the event.
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Mystifur

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Re: various feedback
« Reply #17 on: 25.08.2011, 22:39:34 »

I would like to reply to the fursuit related feedback:

Fursuit Lounge and service:
Yes, the lounge was set up and maintained by a staff group. Namely the Fursuit Support Team. You can find their names in the staff listing in the conbook. Speaking for everyone in the group here: We do very much appreciate your feedback and thanks. It's what keeps us going.

Parade and group photo:
Without going into too much detail here, let me assure you that we didn't make light of putting it in the timetable. We shoved it around for several days to find the spot that least interfered with other events and staff duties.
Yes, the weather timing was most inconvenient as well. Unfortunately planning a second emergency timeslot is not an option.
For one, nothing assures us that the other slot has better weather. Secondly, the parade binds about 20 people of staff. Fursuit-Support, ConOps, Security. All with their own duty schedule.
I'm also sorry if someone thought the parade would be cancelled. No one of staff ever said anything like that. It was announced to be delayed for a few minutes to wait for better weather.

It might please you to hear that we're pondering to relocate photo and parade start to a place where we can better communicate and minimize misunderstandings.

Emergency fursuit lounge on sunday:
You indeed did the right thing when you found it occupied by non suiters: Get someone from staff to help you. And I take it that this worked out fine.
If suiters found the level of service in the sunday lounge less perfect than in the main lounge, I would like to point out that the convention officially ends on sunday noon. Everything is broken down and loaded onto the trucks. No fans or drinks on sunday. The impromptu lounge, the dancefloor and lounge blowers and the drinks were courtesy of staff members, willing to extend the service and load things on monday along with their own luggage, and the hotel being tolerant enough to allowing us to use the corner and serving the drinks right next to the bar.
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lockheed

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Re: various feedback
« Reply #18 on: 25.08.2011, 23:19:18 »

ohh .. I loved the Lobby's 'Coffee to go".  cheap and a big paper cup. have you ever tried to drink more than 2 of them for breakfast?
sorry, caffeine addict ^^
Lockheed
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