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[TiGWolf]

Oh while were asking for money, I have 25 friends that would like to attend but are too broke to make it as well. Can you donate 30,000 Euros to me so I can bring my friends as well? It won't be as fun without them.

Please send money to TigWolfs-Friends@money-for-nothin.com

I will fly all my friends first class, and we will use the money to buy lots of alcohol!

[Zefiro]

I will fly all my friends first class, and we will use the money to buy lots of alcohol!

Sounds like a good deal.

Say, will your friends also be able to provide professional entertainment for our >1000 guests? With a growing EF, we could really use some more good entertainers. Obviously, just getting drunk and talking stuff in front of a few friends is not enough. They'd need to be the kind of guys EF security would want to drag towards the stage - and not away from it :)

*purrrr*

[Cheetah]

Please send money to TigWolfs-Friends@money-for-nothin.com

The Gryphon has been providing one of the most popular stage events at Eurofurence. Five years in a row. For free, as a volunteer, coming in from another continent. If that has earned him enough gratitude that people are willing to donate for him to help finance his trip to return (and perform another free three-hour show) in economically difficult times, I see absolutely no justification for public displays of spite or jealousy. This is an entirely voluntary thing. If you do not want to support Two the Ranting Gryphon, feel free to simply not donate.

[Eisfuchs]

Oh while were asking for money, I have 25 friends that would like to attend but are too broke to make it as well. Can you donate 30,000 Euros to me so I can bring my friends as well? It won't be as fun without them.

Please send money to TigWolfs-Friends@money-for-nothin.com

I will fly all my friends first class, and we will use the money to buy lots of alcohol!

LOL

[Suran]

Would be a shame not to have 2 at EF.

[TiGWolf]

Please send money to TigWolfs-Friends@money-for-nothin.com

The Gryphon has been providing one of the most popular stage events at Eurofurence. Five years in a row. For free, as a volunteer, coming in from another continent. If that has earned him enough gratitude that people are willing to donate for him to help finance his trip to return (and perform another free three-hour show) in economically difficult times, I see absolutely no justification for public displays of spite or jealousy. This is an entirely voluntary thing. If you do not want to support Two the Ranting Gryphon, feel free to simply not donate.

Oh my mistake. I didn't realize that gave you the right to openly ask for donations to go to a con than others. I suppose if some nobody came along and asked for donations, a different light would be cast upon it.

It's just not right. If you can't afford to go, then don't go! I myself debated over several weeks (thanks Leowi for giving me the time) if I could budget the expense to attend. Going to Eurofurence is not a life and death thing. Yes it's a great vacation, but there will be another one next year I'm sure of it.

Besides, there are a lot of other people that would love to donate their talents for entertainment. Why not give them a moment in the limelight?

[Suran]

.o0(they simply don´t come that highly recommended)

[Nightfox]

@ TiGWolf

Maybe you have never seen it but Further Confusion for example had a button on their main page for Travel donations.

Everybody was able to sign up and people could decide if they send money or not.


And of course everybody could open such a topic in our forum for everybody, no matter if you are popular or not.

There was the same thing going on last year for Thimothy Albee too.

And another thing is, if you don't like "2" nobody forces you to give money, its that simple. There is no need for hard feelings in this thread.
Those things belong to private messages.

[Keidran]

Please send money to TigWolfs-Friends@money-for-nothin.com

The Gryphon has been providing one of the most popular stage events at Eurofurence. Five years in a row. For free, as a volunteer, coming in from another continent. If that has earned him enough gratitude that people are willing to donate for him to help finance his trip to return (and perform another free three-hour show) in economically difficult times, I see absolutely no justification for public displays of spite or jealousy. This is an entirely voluntary thing. If you do not want to support Two the Ranting Gryphon, feel free to simply not donate.

Oh my mistake. I didn't realize that gave you the right to openly ask for donations to go to a con than others. I suppose if some nobody came along and asked for donations, a different light would be cast upon it.

It's just not right. If you can't afford to go, then don't go! I myself debated over several weeks (thanks Leowi for giving me the time) if I could budget the expense to attend. Going to Eurofurence is not a life and death thing. Yes it's a great vacation, but there will be another one next year I'm sure of it.

Besides, there are a lot of other people that would love to donate their talents for entertainment. Why not give them a moment in the limelight?

like it was said. 2 was there 5 years in a row. He is known A LOT in furry fandom cause of his awesomeness. If there are other talented Furries who want to SERIOUSLY make a show, then they - I guess - can come to the con, talk with cheetah and the other staffies, maybe do an audition and maaaybe he'll get a small time space for performance.
2 has proven that he is absolutely fit for the furry horde, make 97% of them laughing. But yes. Most of the people have to look where to get the money for ef. It's not few (esspecially for non euros). But with the fame there comes the privileges. And it's not even HIMSELF. it's Uncle - Fucking - Kage who asks for his stage commrade who is - like I said - well known in Furry fandom (in the good way)
It's late so I write again: Fame = privileges.

[BigBlueFox]

Nobody forces anyone to donate.

If you have one hundred friends that you want to show up at EF, grow some balls and start a donation fund for all of them.

I have the feeling that all the people that bitch on LJ, Twitter, this Forum etc. will eventually attend EF and enjoy 2's show. I personally wouldn't mind excluding them from this event, since apparently, they cannot tolerate other people trying to help in one particular situation.

Of course, it won't come to that. So please keep on flaming. See you at Kage vs. 2.

[Cheetah]

Oh my mistake. I didn't realize that gave you the right to openly ask for donations to go to a con than others.

Of course everyone has that right. Including you. There's no right to be successful with it, though. Maybe, if you hadn't made that cynical remark further up in this thread, you'd have had a chance that a couple of good friends and acquaintances might have offered to help you out with a couple of their spare euros. Many returning friends and guests of Eurofurence have been sponsored by generous individuals or groups of friends in the past. Asking for donations is not an uncommon thing. Other conventions even have organized travel funds for this purpose.

Besides, there are a lot of other people that would love to donate their talents for entertainment. Why not give them a moment in the limelight?

We (= Eurofurence) did so in the past, and we continue doing so - if those people approach us, and tell us HOW they would love to donate their talents. We generally do not pay fees to contributors, though. Eurofurence does not have the budget for this, and besides, we prefer to keep it an event that is run by people motivated by their devotion to the community. And in that regard, I believe the community directly rewarding those contributors couldn't be further from "just wrong". It's "just right".

(Note: We usually do help cover material costs for events, and if a reliable staff member or long-time contributor gets into trouble, or in case of very important events that are simply worth it, we usually help covering other expenses too. But we do insist on proper documentation. No payment for profit. And when we're out of money, we're out of money.)

That said, if you want to start a fundraiser to get someone else talented over here who can't make it on his own, you're more than welcome to do so. If those talented people you're speaking of, provide the community a great service in return, I think it's a very charitable thing to do.

[Skie]

I think you miss TigWolf point, which he probably presented badly (and maybe few of you just like to attack people first).
I think most furries including him, would be happy to see 2, and have 2 at EF. I know I would.

The point is that famous furs can more easily ask for such donations, and people like TigWolf simply find it's not fair.
But as mentioned above, nothing much can be done about such unfairness other than choosing not to donate.

[Zefiro]

The point is that famous furs can more easily ask for such donations, and people like TigWolf simply find it's not fair.

I read it differently. He stated that he thinks only famous furs may openly ASK for donations, and others wouldn't be allowed to. Which is simply wrong.

That famous ones would have a much higher probability to actually GET donations is a different story - and fairness or not, being famous means very many ppl know and like you. So, by pure definition, you've a higher chance and a larger number of ppl able and willing to donate. Now, you can claim it being unfair that you're not famous...

Besides, choosing not to donate with the single reason of it "not being fair" sounds pretty dumb and short-sighted to me. You're also buying the more expensive stuff in the supermarket... ah, no, ALL stuff in the market, 'cause it wouldn't be fair to the other producers, would it?

*purrrr*

[Cheetah]

The point is that famous furs can more easily ask for such donations, and people like TigWolf simply find it's not fair.
But as mentioned above, nothing much can be done about such unfairness other than choosing not to donate.

I agree, everyone should have the legal right to have the same amount of supporters. The current model where everyone can freely choose who their friends are is unfair. We should maintain a central registry that decides for you who your friends and supporters are.  And of course people should also not be allowed to donate as much as they want to to the people they like! Therefore the registry would also track the value of all the gifts that furries give to each other, and if someone goes over their monthly gift-quota, it is automatically redirected to someone everyone hates.

I think that would be a much superiour community model





....




Honestly. I think it's time to end this argument. Everyone can start his own fundraiser for the people they like if they want to. If people want to donate or not is their free decision. If you're envious because someone else

- earns more money than you
- has more friends than you
- has more sex than you (oooh-hooo)

then sit down and think what you can do to improve your life, but don't blame it on everyone else except you getting free stuff, because that's really not the case. Thank you!

[BigBlueFox]

So, is it unfair that some people use their talent while others decide to dwell in their mums basement?

Is it unfair that some people going to cons waste a major amount of what little time they have to "serve others" just so those "others" have a reason to bitch about it?

Power, popularity, responsibility, hard work. You can either have ALL of them, or none. It's your life, and it's in your hands.

Don't complain if someone has made it there while you haven't. Change your life if you want to be there, too.